For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Ernie Simmons of Olathe, Kansas, a gunsmithing "whiz-kid" and a fairly good skeet shooter to boot-they were involved in the later cost-saving Winchester ventilated ribs for various Winchester shotguns- Model 12's, Model 50's, possibly Model 21's-. The price in 1963 was $122 compared to $109.50 for the standard Model 12. Winchester Model 12 12 ga 30 in Barrel 2 3/4" Full vent rib Barrel NICE Down pitch remained 2-1/2 inches with the 30-inch barrel throughout production. The latest 2-pin rib gun researched has a serial number of 19114xx with a date of August 26th, 1960. Shopping at Guns.com gives you the backing The locked breech bolts of both guns have little perceptible play when the rear of the bolt is pressed from the side. Writing in the March 1927 issue of the American Rifleman, Askins reports that his Remington Model 10 12-gauge pump averaged 89% of 1 1/4-ounces of shot in a 3-inch circle at 40 yards. Buy 1955 Winchester Model 12 20 GA Simmons Rib AA+ Wood: GunBroker is the largest seller of Pump Action Shotguns Shotguns Guns & Firearms All: 974012213. Winchester proof steel is chrome-molybdenum steel. For more information: www.p65warnings.ca.gov. "Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known." Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. the shot gun is in very good condition , with a 28 in ventilated rib barrel with full choke. It has a fiber optic front sight which is not origina, SOLD Ser no 1949422, Mfg 1962, 3-Pin Vent Rib, Full, 30" Barrel, Signed by M Dubber, Who I beleive was a colt engraver, 14 1/2" Lop to Winchester Red Vented Pad, Comes with case, Excel, Winchester Custom Model 12 20ga 2 3/4" 28" full choke barrel,Simmons vent rib,serial #683559,fancy French Walnut checkered stocks with great color and figure,jeweled bolt and lifter,ex, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 HEAVY DUCK 12GA 3" MAGNUM. Winchester Model 12 28 Gauge (W9229) Price: $3,250.00 Item Number: W9229 Previously sold Winchester Model 12 28 Gauge shotgun. - Straight Sighting Plane - Floating Vent rib action - Extra Strong Silver soldered posts Gun Type Over/Under w/RBSingle Barrel w/RB Askins Ithaca 10-gauge double with 2 7/8-inch chambers averaged 86.9% with 1 5/8-ounces of shot. The 30" heavy barrel is proof stamped "WINCHESTER TRADE MARK MADE IN THE U.S.A."; "-MODEL 12 - 12 GA. - FULL"; "WINCHESTER PROOF STEEL"; "FOR SUPER SPEED & SUPER - X 3 IN.". The Model 12 was about 40 percent more expensive than the '97, yet it consistently outsold its older brother during the 45-year-span they shared in the Winchester catalog. Beautifully figured wood is solid with only light handling marks and marks on bo, This Winchester Model 12 started life in 1924 and has been customized by unknown individual at some point. There were also many ribs installed that were Simmons' design built by Win., and Simmons rib parts purchased by Winchester and installed at Win., and ribs installed by Win. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. The slide handle of early duck guns was round with 18 circular grooves. Jack OConnor was there and sets the scene nicely in the Complete Book of Shooting. I don't believe it has been fired. Auction Date: December 7, 2019 Estimated Price: $ 8,500 - $ 13,000 Price Realized: Details Exceptional and Documented Smoothbore Winchester Model 61 Slide Action "Rifle" with Simmons Vent Rib and Box Manufacturer: Winchester Model: 61 Type: Shotgun Gauge: 22 LR Shot Barrel: 24 inch vent rib Finish: blue Grip: Stock: walnut Item Views: 1599 My 1953 duck gun has the factory solid rib. The balance point is the takedown joint. Generally, a Simmons rib gun will bring a higher price than a plain barrel gun, and a lower price than a solid rib or Winchester vent rib gun, all other factors being equal. The first thing you notice when you pick up a duck gun is its weight and solid feel. On the other hand, a duck caught in the middle of one of these dense-centered pattern sat 40 yards would receive a dozen or more pellets. Winchester Model 12 in 16 ga with a 26" barrel with a full choke. H. Lea Lawrence relates in his 2001 GUN DIGEST article, The Saga of Bo Whoop, that in 1921 John Olin sent Buckingham his personal heavy double, a custom-choked Super Fox, for testing. Model 12 was offered in several different styles: 1. Stock has a Monte Carlo cheekpiece and European pistol grip with a right hand palm swell. These are rare, a line can be seen along the dounut post on both sides. only one I have ever seen unless TS member owns one? When I dress Western, nothing beats the classic good looks of my Smith & Wesson (S&W) 586 .357 revolver. However, killing ducks at long range remained the objective of many duck hunters. The Model 12, already 23 years old, was one of many successful designs by Thomas C. Johnson. I included #2 shot because this size shot has always been my goose and turkey load in 3-inch shells. part of our network, we sell THEIR guns first whenever possible. No Reserve. 3-inch Super Twelve Shotshell My copy of Winchesters Catalog No. It also got a new action slide. Introduced in 20 gauge in 1912, 16 and 12 gauge guns followed in 1914. Winchester Model 12 12 GA For Sale Winchester 12 GA Model 12. A forum community dedicated to Trap shooting enthusiasts. The old trap shooters didn't and they did just fine. Lot 6593: Winchester Model 42 Slide Action Shotgun . Guns.com's selection won't leave you feeling unprepared. He worked with another Winchester researcher. His shotguns were undoubtedly the best long-range duck guns he found in extensive testing. Olin included his new Super-X magnum 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8 ounces of shot. I decided to test the patterning of the five loads detailed in the accompanying table. The short shot string put more shot into a duck whistling by at 50 yards. Consider the possibility of a hang-fire, an occasional event in 1912, in a gun without the slide lock feature. Winchester Model 12 Ribs? | Shotgun Forum Winchester symbol # G1285S. The deeply blued barrel and receiver frame are very good. THE SHOT GUN IS IN VERY GOOD CONDITION , WITH A 28 IN VENTILATED RIB BARREL WITH FULL CHOKE. Herbert Houze summarizes the Watrous report in his book Winchester Repeating Arms Company, Its History & Development from 1865 to 1981. Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. Simmons also removed Solid Ribs from barrels and added his rib to those barrels. In an ad in the October 1952 American Rifleman, Winchester proclaimed. I was at a local gunshop this morning and was looking at a model 12 2-3/4" that had a Simmons rib. Length of pull was reduced in January 1936 to reflect the extra clothing worn by duck hunters. Smith Double Barrel Shotgun $250 Mar 24, 2023 Browning "Twenty" Semi Automatic Shotgun $200 Mar 24, 2023 Browning "Light Twelve" Semi Automatic Shotgun $200 Mar 24, 2023 Browning Pump Action Shotgun $150 This gives a wrinkled appearance on bottom of pistol grip and bottom of forend. I know of a gun shop in Idaho that can take about any model 42 and put on round post ribs or solid ribs that are just like factory original with the proof marks. The standard 12-gauge duck load in 1921 was a 2 3/4-inch shell holding 3 3/4-drams equivalent powder and 1 1/4-ounces of shot. Tommy, I would be interested in one of the guns you describe. Winchester proof steel replaced nickel steel in the manufacture of all Winchester firearms in the early 1930s. Interchangeable barrels (forend assembly) for 2 3/4-inch shells and choke of choice were special order. Important to note that this gun was made in 1956, the first year for the round post factory installed Special Ve, FOR YOUR VIEWING IS A VERY NICE WINCHESTER MODEL 12 in 20 GA. WITH A VENT RIBBED 26" BARREL AND IC CHOKED. Skeet gun marked "2 7/8" chamber skeet 28 gauge. Standard markings, with matching numbers on the receiver and barrel. For specifics on Copyright Law and This likely was the last mention of solid ribs in Winchester literature. The duck gun was discontinued in 1963. Thanks for all the info,my Grandfather died when I was in 12th grade in 1971 and I now have his field grade Mod.12 and 9 others love them all.I also have my Great Grandfathers Mod.97. Simmons also removed Solid Ribs from barrels and added his rib to those barrels. Most everything can be easily bought online these days. Although the quality of the rib will be the same as the original Winchester, the only way a Simmons rib looks OK on a Model 12 is if they DON'T put their silly name down the side of the rib. When it was. Winchester Model 1300 Speed Pump - 12 GA $395.00: 0 $395.00 1d 15h 33m 17222600. Only rib extensions of the same width as the factory ventilate drib are found on receivers of duck guns. There is a moderate mark as shown in the photograph. I read your posts; you do love the Model 12, been there done that. Winchester 12 Shotgun 12 | Rock Island Auction After college and had some $$$ I started collecting them. Teal, mallard, widgeon and sprig [pintail] hover singly and in bunches overhead. The Simmons rib is done at Winchesters direction as it has the WP proof offset from the rib. No Reserve. organized, dont tell you a lot about what youre buying, and leave you on your DAC 1 1/2"&n, FRO YOUR VIEWING IS A EXCEPTIONALY NICE MODEL 12 IN 3' HEAVY DUCK. I RATE THE BLUING AT 98% AND THE WOOD AT 96+%. A 2pin vent rib lets the shooter sight under the bird and keep the bird in sight. His Super Fox 12 gauge magnum double averaged 83.7% (two-barrel average) of 1 3/8ounces of shot under the same conditions. Model 42s with later ribs than the donut post, with no Simmons markings or with Simmons markings, and with proof marks in the proper places are thought to have had their ribs installed at Simmons and sent back to Winchester for marketing or marketed at Simmons. It looks like it is in very good shape. The Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck Gun Proved Itself a Shooter Harold Williamson, in his book Winchester, The Gun That Won the West, relates that the new management of Winchester embarked on a program that involved an extraordinary departure from the companys previous operations and the investment of borrowed capital in large amounts. Winchester struggled through a decade of inept product diversification that was terminated by the Great Depression. Now I have never been wrong about anything in my lifeLOLjust kidding, but the way I read it on the top of page 109JMHOThanks, WC. Ventilated Rib Barrel Add On For Shotgun: Simmons Gun Repair We limited our shooting to 25 yards or less and seldom missed. Winchester Model 12 Original and Reproduction Firearm Gun Parts Emphasis was placed on loads of #4 shot because of its historical significance in waterfowl hunting and association with the long-range objectives of the Model 12 duck gun. It is, somehow, not easy to avoid shoving shells wrong end first into ones gun. Simmons Gun Specialties rib has been added to barrel. Possible the fore end has been either replaced or re done. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Winchester Pump Shotguns (2) - Collectors Firearms Featured Gun Classifieds Winchester Shotguns - Model 12, Winchester Model 12 - 20ga - 26 - Improved Cylinder- NIB - UNFIRED - SN: MT0162 - AS NEW with high figured wood - 2 3/4" Shells note: particles/dust can be seen in the photo, In very good condition. I hunker down and blaze away. Condition: excellent bright bore, 98% blue overall thinn, Winchester Model 12. I sold 41 model 12's and 21's at a gun auction in Wichita Kansas to accommodate the move. My second blast bites off a dismayed climber. Solid rib model 12 made in 1954. It is not as slow or pokey as one might expect. The staff shot skeet with the gun and concluded It is not as fast as the standard Model-12, but nearly so., In further shooting tests the staff found We could not discern any practical difference in recoil effect when shooting standard three inch heavy duck loads. Winchester supplied two boxes of 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8-ounces of #5 chilled shot pushed by four drams equivalent of powder. The Winchester Model 12: A Look Back - An Official Journal Of The NRA The Model 12 shotgun, initially the Model 1912, hit the market in August 1912. I believe that Stadt's book is one of the few that actually states that Winchester did produce M42s with Winchester vent ribs. The history of Oliver F. Winchester (1810-1880) and his endeavors in the manufacturing of fire-arm sat Bridgeport and New Haven, Connecticut, is filled with circumstances that could have led to corporate failure. I rebuilt all of the trigger assemble with all new parts just reusing the guard. Pictures are of the item listed. Featherweight: same as above; lightweight alloy trigger guard. *** RARE *** Winchester Model 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN limited production run that combines the pre-64 Model 12 with a 12 ga. Magnum 30" barrel, factory production 3" Magnum, with a factory Simmons Vent Rib on an upgraded wood stock! To elaborate on lowgun's response, the "round post" rib was made by Simmons, not Winchester. Edwin Pugsley, in charge of Winchester at the time of receivership, is quoted in Williamsons book: The purchase of the company by the Olin interests brought a breath of life to the institution and brought to Winchester many things. Must be shipped to an FFL, New price, Listed is a like new Winchester DU, Model-12, 12 Ga Pump Shotgun. ORIGINAL BOX INCLUDED. Outdoor Hub, LLC (d/b/a Carbon Media Group), 30800 Telegraph Rd, Suite 1921, Bingham Farms, MI 48025 USA. 1937 2pin vent rib offerd, all skeet grade guns offerd with solid or plain barrels. There are 3 possible models that you might have: 1) Your Model 12 has a grooved slide handle and with a 'F' stamped after the serial number and has a lightweight alloy trigger guard. Sto, Used Winchester 12 20 Gauge, Pump-Action Shotgun, 25" Barrel Wood Stock, No Box. , Excellent Winchester Model 12 12 gauge Deluxe Skeet gun with factory issued Cutts Compensator. Askins rule of thumb of 70 years ago still pertains with modern lead-shot ammunition. Number 8 and 2 shot provided wider and more even patterns with no center thickening. THE SHOTGUN HAS A 30' PLAIN BARREL AND IS FULL CHOKE. custom bolt act. be complicated. Winchester Model 12 16 ga NIB Never Assembled! These were called long-range waterfowl guns.. Looks to me a bit like the raised rib on a Lutjic one barrel trap gun- and the 870- well, Rudy Etchen shot a 12 gauge 870 Trap Grade he got new in 1950-I'd like to have a C-note for every clay bird, box pigeon and game bird he shattered with that old Remmie- I could move in next to Bill Gates- or maybe his gardener!! 1955 Winchester Model 12 20 GA Simmons Rib AA+ Wood But I manage to concentrate, find the combination, and center a pair of easy sprigs. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. By 1955, the options were matted rib, ventilated rib, straight or pistol grip stock and buttstock and extension slide handle checkered. Remington re-tooled from the M31 to the stamp, push and press 870 which sold for less than the M12. customers to the absolute best of our abilities. Has 30" barrel choked Full. Add to Cart Winchester 12 12 Gauge (W9744) $995.00 Winchester 12 12 Gauge shotgun. Also, the rib and its receiver extension cover the Winchester proof marks, a sure sign that it is not factory installed. Sales of 100,000 were recorded in the first two years of production. A Cold War era classic with smooth lines, a legendary back story, and an exotic-sounding name, Beretta's Model 71 was definitely a mouse that roared. An 80% pattern they felt should make it a real 60-yard outfit with No. THE VENTILATED RIB IS BY SIMMONS GIN, 16ga, Full Choke, 26" barrel with a bright and shiny bore. is 14" with pad. Western brought out their Super-X 2-3/4 and 3-inch shotshells in 1921. In fact, Madis states Any twelve gauge Model Twelve could be re-chambered and reworked to shoot three inch shells for a small additional charge[by Winchester], yet few guns were reworked in this way. I can find no external differences in receiver dimensions, other than the ejection port, between standard and magnum versions. 30" Full choke barrel. BARREL 30" CHOKE FULL 90% FACTORY BLUE ORIGINAL FACTORY HEAVY DUCK RECOIL PAD WOOD VERY GOOD. If not it has been shot very little and stored under the right conditions. If you pull the trigger and the shell does not fire you must push the slide handle forward to unlock the action. Some will even go 85% to 90%, but rarely. Keith, who obtained Askins Ithaca 10 magnum double upon Askins death, achieved 93% patterns with two ounces of copper-plated#3 shot in the big double. becouse plain barrels shoot higher than solid ribs do ,solid ribs shoot flatter. This is a shotgun I should never have sold. The stock finish is original and excellent. JavaScript is disabled. Stadt's book is a very good book that alot of people don't seem to know about. Item . A great looking gun, in excellent condition. See pi, Winchester Model 12, 28 gauge SKEET pump action shotgun, circa 1955. There are Simmons marketed guns with proper Winchester proof marks. Could it be that the intended rough usage led to lack of care in the fitting of parts of early duck guns? You are correct. However, the gun for which Johnson is best remembered is his Model 12 pump-action shotgun, The Perfect Repeater.. The help you need is to get a life. The Model 12 2 pin rib has always been "KING" but don't turn you nose up @ a Dounut Post model 12 as production in Trap & Skeet model only lasted from late 1955 to 1956 then round post was alternate rib to the 2 pin. PDF March 31, 2023 GUN LOT LIST Page #1 - rgilliganauctions.com Buckingham had a solid 60-yard duck gun and was on his way to becoming a legend. It is the skeet style of stock with a comb drop of 1 1/2 2 1/2 inches, and a 14-inch length, butt to trigger. The survival of both Western and Winchester now depended on Olin management. John Olin initiated an analysis of Winchesters commercial line in 1942. We'rebringing a level of $899.97. As far as early 2 pins, remember there were a few made as early as 1919, standard and "graded" model 12's (ie) "Black Diamaonds" they had the longer checkered forearm. . Firearms dont get much more iconic than John Moses Brownings legendary Auto-5 semi-auto shotgun, affectionately called the Humpback for its distinctive drop at the rear of the receiver. The extra weight is meant to soak up the recoil of what once was thought to be a very hard-kicking load. The buttstock was reshaped on Model 12 shotguns again in the mid-1950s. I offer the following example from What Rarer Day in Buckinghams book De Shootinest Gentman and Other Tales published in 1934. Yes the 2-pin milled rib was costly to manufacture. Thus it was that the American Rifleman staff thought it odd that Winchester brought out the 3-inch chamber in their Model 12 pump gun. He was the chief designer of the Model 21 double, John Olins favorite. Simmons rib on model 12 - The DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com The Duck Stamp Law of 1934 was enacted to provide funds for waterfowl propagation. Will Winchester ever build the Model 12 again? This product contains chemicals known to the state of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm. Winchester Model 12 12 GA For Sale - GunAuction.com It has the long action slide handle. The duck gun made in 1952 has a Simmons ventilated rib. The vent rib is stamped "SIMMONS GUN SPECIALTIES INC. KANSAS CITY, MO.". Mechanically excellent. Very fine as professionally custom finished, showing 95% of the refurbished blue, with scattered rust spotting and handling marks. In 1960, length of pull was increased to 13-3/4 inches on duck guns. Here-tofore, you could only shoot this weight of shot in a 10-gauge double gun with 2 7/8-inch chambers, or the new Ithaca Magnum 10. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. No Reserve. Factory original Model 12s with round post ribs were made by Winchester, not Simmons. MAKE OFFER. Charles Askins confirmed the tighter patterns and greater effective range in the field. 26" Vent Rib Barrels Choked SKEET. Beautiful grain pattern and very tight hand checkering on the stock . Two birds tumble all awry from among the leaders. No. says Madis. Winchester suggests their 3-inch 12-gauge shotshells with 1 3/8-ounces or 1 5/8-ounces of #4 shot for wildfowl hunting in their 1951 Ammunition Handbook: These shells were developed especially for extremes in long range shooting with 12-gauge Winchester Model 12 and Model 21 Heavy Duck Guns.. 12 Gauge, This is a very nice Winchester Model 12 Trap pump action shotgun in 12 gauge. . later on flinching became a problem with 12 gauge shooters becouse of 300 round tournaments. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Spend your time enjoying the gun you want, not getting frustrated with a complex website that makes gun buying hard. Winchester Model 12 - CHUCKHAWKS.COM This is why they were rust blued instead of hot blued. Winchester Model 12 Shotguns For Sale - GunAuction.com Madis comments Fancy walnut was considered too fancy for the rough treatment often given a duck gun. Fancy walnut could be ordered and the few pidgeon-grade duck guns had fancy walnut. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Duck guns always sold for a slight premium over the standard model. I don't believe their ever was a royalty, actually Simmons kept selling his special vent rib model 12's after the 1955 introduction of the Winchester Special Vent Rib @ New Haven. I would think if you did shoot you proble flinch like heck becouse ther must be a lot of jerk in you. Included with the gun is its orig, Winchester Model 12, 28 Gauge in very good to near fine original condition. Winchester - Model 12 Factory Try-Gun, 12ga, 30" Barrel. George Madis indicates in his book The Winchester Model Twelve that about 18,000 Model 12 duck guns were sold during the 1935-1941 period. Terms and Conditions and Privacy Policy. That way, were helping small businesses in We have a In their view, the Model 12 pump with 3-inch chamber was likely to sell better than a similarly chambered Model 21 double. He did note, however, that the rib first appeared at about serial number 240,000. Buckingham is jump-shooting with his big double gun. It has a Simmons rib, which is not out of the question for Winchester to have used according to Maddis in his book of the model 12's. The metal finish is superior to a field grade gun, higher polish and a matted receiver top and magazine tube.
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